Title: Prep work
Post by: on October 09, 2004, 07:00:53 pm
I have sandblasted two machines.
(1st Machine) Sandblasted and then DA sanded to try something different.
(2nd Machine) Just sandblasted.
I then applied DX 579 Metal Cleaner (a multi-purpose phosphoric cleaner and prepaint conditioner).
I then applied DX 520 Metal Conditioner (a phosphoric acid based chemical that produces a zinc phosphate coating on steel surfaces.
This was performed on both machines. Why am I freaking out? Because before I applied these chemicals to prepare for priming they looked real nice. Now...
Machine #1 (sandblasted and DA sanded) has brown staines on parts of the metal.
Machine #2 (sandblasted only) has streaks and whole large blotches of brown stain everywhere.
Is this a natural result of chemical treating and is it what I am to expect?
If so can I now continue with the body work ie. dent removal and body filler? And then go on to priming?
Or should I just start over and sandblast again. And this time maybe just use PickleX Pro as a pretreatment to body work and priming?
Please give me some advise on this matter as I sure would hate to start over.
Duane
(1st Machine) Sandblasted and then DA sanded to try something different.
(2nd Machine) Just sandblasted.
I then applied DX 579 Metal Cleaner (a multi-purpose phosphoric cleaner and prepaint conditioner).
I then applied DX 520 Metal Conditioner (a phosphoric acid based chemical that produces a zinc phosphate coating on steel surfaces.
This was performed on both machines. Why am I freaking out? Because before I applied these chemicals to prepare for priming they looked real nice. Now...
Machine #1 (sandblasted and DA sanded) has brown staines on parts of the metal.
Machine #2 (sandblasted only) has streaks and whole large blotches of brown stain everywhere.
Is this a natural result of chemical treating and is it what I am to expect?
If so can I now continue with the body work ie. dent removal and body filler? And then go on to priming?
Or should I just start over and sandblast again. And this time maybe just use PickleX Pro as a pretreatment to body work and priming?
Please give me some advise on this matter as I sure would hate to start over.
Duane
Title: Prep work
Post by: Bob K on October 11, 2004, 07:04:54 am
Duane, have you contacted the manufacturer of this product and posed this question to them? Don't completely freak out until you get their feedback. You may be fine.
Bob
Bob
Title: Prep work
Post by: loman4ec on October 11, 2004, 08:50:31 am
I don't know this for sure but I asked my paint shop and they said that if you leave the metal prep on there too long the acid will speed up the rust process. Does it look like it is surface rust?
Title: Prep work
Post by: on October 15, 2004, 10:14:02 pm
| Quote (loman4ec @ Oct. 11 2004,6:50) |
| I don't know this for sure but I asked my paint shop and they said that if you leave the metal prep on there too long the acid will speed up the rust process. Does it look like it is surface rust? |
I did call the auto paint store and the guy said that it was not normal to have the big brown stains but it does happen. He suggested that I sand down with 320 grit sandpaper and go ahead and prime.
I called a competiters auto paint store and the said start over again.
So, what to do?
And yes, there are amounts of surface rust developing.
Dam, this bothers me that I can not get a definitive answer to a simple question from auto paint stores!
Title: Prep work
Post by: MoonDawg on October 16, 2004, 10:52:59 am
I also use a rust prohibitor on bare metal and yes it does dis-color the metal but my paint store told me this was OK. It has gone in and frozen any rust that was existing.
I would go ahead and sand and primer, I'm sure you will be just fine!
I would go ahead and sand and primer, I'm sure you will be just fine!
Title: Prep work
Post by: on October 16, 2004, 12:05:19 pm
Thanks moondawg
Guess what I am going to do is go ahead and sand down both machines to get what I can off and then primer one of them and leave the other for now and see what happens. The one I do not prime right away will be put in the basement where it can be kept warm to reduce any further surface rust.
Do you or anyone else have any experience with a product called pickelX. A rust retardant/inhibitor. A site called autobodyshop.com and their discussion group members swear by it. It is used after sandblasting or other means of paint removal and then sprayed or brushed on the steel surfaces to prevent and retard rust. Restoration is then performed as normal.
Would be happy to hear if any of our fellow soda machine restorers have tried it.
Thanks, Duane
Guess what I am going to do is go ahead and sand down both machines to get what I can off and then primer one of them and leave the other for now and see what happens. The one I do not prime right away will be put in the basement where it can be kept warm to reduce any further surface rust.
Do you or anyone else have any experience with a product called pickelX. A rust retardant/inhibitor. A site called autobodyshop.com and their discussion group members swear by it. It is used after sandblasting or other means of paint removal and then sprayed or brushed on the steel surfaces to prevent and retard rust. Restoration is then performed as normal.
Would be happy to hear if any of our fellow soda machine restorers have tried it.
Thanks, Duane
Title: Prep work
Post by: on October 16, 2004, 06:22:29 pm
Good News
I have finished sanding down one of the machines and it looks great. The metal is not as shiney as when just sanded down to metal without cleaner/conditioner and has a slight gray dull look but at least now I feel good about it. Now it is ready for priming, the only problem is that my garage is not heated and it is below 55 degrees here and expected to stay that way all week. (Not exceptable for painting). I will figure a way to get it done next weekend what ever it takes. Then I have some major dent work to do and the usual bondo, sanding, blocking etc. Two of the panels on the 55 I am working on are really gonna take some work on my part. But I enjoy it!
Duane
I have finished sanding down one of the machines and it looks great. The metal is not as shiney as when just sanded down to metal without cleaner/conditioner and has a slight gray dull look but at least now I feel good about it. Now it is ready for priming, the only problem is that my garage is not heated and it is below 55 degrees here and expected to stay that way all week. (Not exceptable for painting). I will figure a way to get it done next weekend what ever it takes. Then I have some major dent work to do and the usual bondo, sanding, blocking etc. Two of the panels on the 55 I am working on are really gonna take some work on my part. But I enjoy it!
Duane
Title: Prep work
Post by: loman4ec on October 16, 2004, 10:38:26 pm
Do you have a tool rental place in town. If so rent a torpedo heater and heat your garage. I would get those machines primered ASAP if I were you.
Title: Prep work
Post by: on October 17, 2004, 05:02:52 pm
| Quote (loman4ec @ Oct. 16 2004,8:38) |
| Do you have a tool rental place in town. If so rent a torpedo heater and heat your garage. I would get those machines primered ASAP if I were you. |
Gas or kerosene?
Shouldn't there be some sort of ventilation also?
Title: Prep work
Post by: loman4ec on October 17, 2004, 05:35:13 pm
They are Kerosene. Yes you would not want to use it in your house but in a garage you could raise the door a crack.
Title: Prep work
Post by: on October 17, 2004, 09:42:13 pm
Begs the question What to do Heat the garage spray then vent garage then reheat for drying Since you wouldnt want the heater going when spraying with teeny tiny particals of Combustion goodness floating around !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Prep work
Post by: loman4ec on October 18, 2004, 06:37:02 am
I never thought of that. I have used them for heating garages but never while painting since I have a pro do all of my painting. I would just suggest to heat the garage then shut the heater off and then apply the paint. The garage shouldnt cool down that quick. Or just take it to a paint shop and either have them paint it or you never know they might let you use the paint booth while they are closed. It would be worth a try. The worst thing someone can say is no. I live in Florida now so there isn't much need for heaters too often here. I hope this helped. I apologize for the explosive suggestion.